2011-07-31
kpato
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Okey, now it is the time.
i want seriusly to learn how to play this game.
i Have Goban for mac, and i bought a book calls “Go fundamentals”
it was to basic, i didnt learn anything.
What do u recommend me to learn?
there is a lot of stuff TOO BASIC
and there is a lot of stuff TOO ADVANCED.
I need something in the middle, to get start.
Knowing only the rules, means nothing!.
Thanks for your help.
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2011-07-31
wanderer_c
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I don’t know what its availability is, but I think “The Second Book of Go” would be perfect for what you are describing. It is by Richard Bozulich and the one I have was published by Ishi Press, though I vaguely recall that Ishi went out of business.
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2011-07-31
Julius Sneezer
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the best one still in print in my opinion is ‘teach yourself go’ by charles matthews. a few years ago i bought 3 books, and this was the only one i didn’t regret buying.
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2011-07-31
erratic
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I have around 40 pdf-ed go books not including papers. I didn’t read them all. You should not expect to become stronger by reading a book. But you do have to read books to know strategic concepts you wouldn’t pay attention to if you hadn’t read about them. Mastering go is about having deeper and deeper insight into these concepts. For example ko is an idea that can be explained to a 30kyu, but as the player evolves he/she deepens more and more in everything related to ko (the threats, value of threats, the value of local threats, n-step ko, double ko, how to create threats before, etc.) that make him/her understand ko at dan level. Most strategic concepts are like that, the first time you get an oversimplified idea and as you progress you understand them better. A book will show you what to pay attention at, but it won’t make you stronger. If you intend to download books, don’t miss:
Kajiwara, The Direction of Play
Matthews, Shape up!
Takagawa, The Vital Points of Fuseki (it is a collection of articles edited as a book)
Seigen, Go on Go; The Analyzed Games of Go Seigen
to name a few
And do problems!
Doing problems is never wrong.
You can use http://www.goproblems.com/
and do problems of all levels. Lower level problems train your killer instinct you should solve the problems as the board shows up without even reading the text. Problems of your level are good practice, but problems of higher level are great too. Even if you cannot solve them, try them and learn them and figure out how to answer against alternative responses of your opponent. It is a very good practice and some day you will play in a game the same you learned by heart. Learning dan problems makes you learn good moves.
Of course, all this is based on personal experience. Other people may recommend lessons (in KGS) or learning pro games, etc.
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2011-07-31
JeanHebert
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In my opinion, the best way to start learning Go is to play quick games on KGS. There is a proverb that says you have to lose your first 100 games before learning Go.
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2011-08-01
erratic
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Of course.
Nothing is meant “instead of” playing. You have to play a lot. But playing alone is not enough.
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2011-08-01
pfafulous
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Jean is right, need to quickly lose 100 games. Do it with 9x9.
http://playgo.to/iwtg/en/ is an invaluable resource. The beginning lessons may seem too basic for you, but there’s a method to it. Don’t skip ahead, go through them all. Wax on, wax off. (There’s a Spanish language version of it if you prefer.)
For books, I started with Janice Kim’s series, and found the first couple to be very helpful. She has a nice accessible way of teaching (brag: I’ve taken many lessons from her in person!).
On the iPhone, SmartGo Pro is one of the best apps I’ve purchased. It has a high price tag, but the resources inside are tremendous, including hundreds of professional games dating back centuries, and countless problems at all levels!
I am “DrTeeth” on KGS. I hang around the Beginners Room sometimes. Always happy to give lessons, so don’t be shy about asking for one if you see me. Welcome to the fold! I hope you enjoy the game.
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2011-08-01
dead eye
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Kpato, if your book is “lessons in the fundamentals” by Kageyama in fact it is a very well respected book for beginners and intermediates so dont throw it away!
But like the other guys say, play a lot of games and learn to estimate the score on every move, and count your own liberties and those of your opponent. By counting liberties you can start to understand shape.
good luck
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2011-08-02
kpato
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its not.
its calls “Go fundamentals” and it is less that the wikipedia Go article.
Well guys, get agree in 1 book, i will buy it.
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2011-08-02
pfafulous
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There’s no 1 book that will make you a Go expert, and we each have found different books useful to our individual learning styles. There are many aspects to the game, and even after reading a dozen books on a dozen subjects, you’ll need to re-read them many times. There are many good recommendations here, you can’t go wrong with any of them.
When I was starting the game, I found Janice Kim’s Learn to Play Go series to be wonderful. Very balanced look at the game, and covers all aspects with a light, accessible style and good sense of humor. It’s a 3-part series, but the first book covers capturing, connecting and cutting, life and death, ko, and counting territory.
Other good books:
Graded Go Problems for Beginners, Vol 1
Opening Theory Made Easy
To delve a bit deeper, there’s the Elementary Go Series, although I recommend skipping the Joseki volume for a while. And once you have a good handle on the game, Kajiwara’s The Direction of Play is one of my favorite books ever written on the game, although there are still sections well beyond my current capabilities.
http://playgo.to/iwtg/ is also something I used to learn the game, and is recommended by KGS.
http://www.goproblems.com/ is also very good. They say 15 minutes of life & death problems a day is all it takes to get stronger.
Playing a lot of games quickly is a must. http://www.gokgs.com/ ... Download the applet (recommended), or play it through your web java. Go to the Beginner’s Room and play a bunch of 9x9 games, either against players there or against the bots.
Have fun!
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2011-08-05
pfafulous
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kpato, I took one of your old games and used it as a basis of giving some lessons. I know you think some things are too “basic” but please don’t skip any part of this. The game itself is basic. The concepts I learned as 25k are still concepts I study as 5k, it’s just a matter of depth of understanding. Learning go is a journey of 1000 small steps.
http://eidogo.com/#url:http://pfapfap.org/go/kpato.v.nevermind-2008.02.19.sgf
You can use the arrow keys to go back and forth along the game path, if clicking the mouse every turn gets too annoying. Remember to click on the side paths when they show up, as they contain a lot of information.
I hope you find this helpful!
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2011-08-05
kpato
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Wow!!
Thanks a lot Pfapfap
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2011-08-05
pfafulous
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No problem, I enjoy giving lessons. Look for me on KGS in the Beginners Room as DrTeeth, we can play a game and review it live. Welcome to the game!
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2011-08-11
Felipe Herman van Riemsdijk
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Hello,
I also enjoy giving some lessons,
I am about japanese 4d-5d[kgs 1d-2d],
If you want me to comment a game just send me the .sgf file to the_1st_blade@hotmail.com
I just dont have THAT much time right now but I intend on commenting games as soon as possible, since its a praticle way to force myself to study
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2011-08-17
pfafulous
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Thank you very much for the review, Felipe!
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2011-08-19
maraca
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Maybe you could post the review here if the players don’t have something against it. I would be interested in the review too, to learn something.
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2011-08-19
MichaeI X
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maraca, pfapfap already posted his helpful review/tutorial here, as a link to http://eidogo.com/#url:http://pfapfap.org/go/kpato.v.nevermind-2008.02.19.sgf
I’d appreciate as well, if Felipe (or pfapfap on his behalf) would post Felipe’s review.
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2011-08-19
pfafulous
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http://eidogo.com/#url:http://pfapfap.org/go/drteeth.v.artham-2011.08.04.sgf
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2011-08-19
pfafulous
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That’s Felipe’s review of my game on KGS. Someone told me once, but I forgot how to post links.
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2011-08-19
Felipe Herman van Riemsdijk
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It is simple HTML code, I think, but not 100% sure ^^
never posted a link here either ^^
I hope you guys enjoy my review Im a bit rusty
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2011-08-19
pfafulous
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2011-08-19
pfafulous
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2011-08-20
gpallis
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One of the very best and wisest Go proverbs I know: “Lose your first fifty games as quickly as possible”.
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2011-08-21
maraca
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Thanks. I especially liked the comment on move 46 where you recommend some spots to play.
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2011-08-22
Felipe Herman van Riemsdijk
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Btw sry about the misspeling on the review,
my english its not great and above all this notebook’s keyboard its just terrible
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2011-08-24
sm9
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Life and Death by James Davies (a yellow book that I’ve had so long it has faded to white), or some similar L&D book. You’re just thrashing around like a headless chicken if you don’t know the standard dead/unsettled/alive eye shapes.
For instance, and while talking about losing your first 50 games: I think I lost all fifty from trying to make L-shapes in the corner live. Any stronger opponent instantly knows it is dead; when I play a defense move in the corner they don’t need to have remembered the killer moves; all they know is that it can be killed, Then they will focus all their reading attention on it.
My second choice would be a tesuji problem book. It could be read hand-in-hand with a book on good shape, or you can just keep doing the problems until your brain discovers what is good shape for itself. (Choose the path that suits your personality; for me it is a book that explains what is going on, rather than just tells what the correct answers are.)
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2011-08-24
Aganju
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Ok, here’s my 2 cents: From the ~10 Go books I read or tried to read, I think the James Davies series is by far the best. There are six books in it in total, and one is as valuable as the other.
PS: If anyone wants to sell his set, I’m looking for one.
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2011-08-24
pfafulous
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Agreed, the Davies series is great. Tho' I suggest skipping the joseki dictionary. I know many people like to learn through joseki, but I feel learning L&D and tesuji and shape and the like is easier and more important. sm9 is right, you don’t need to be able to read or memorize everything, you just need to recognize situations. The corner L-shape is a huge one to know! :)
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2011-09-11
Felipe Herman van Riemsdijk
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Another very good series of go books is the one from the Ishii Press, spacially the Handicap Go[dark green cover] and the one about Influence[red cover, regretfully I forgot its name] it seems very simple but even after reading it a couple of times I still learn some quite interesting things each time I re-read it
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2011-10-04
pfafulous
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Here’s a review of a game between Rob and myself, either on EidoGO or as an SGF.
From you dan-level players, review of my review is always welcome. Enjoy!
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2011-10-07
Dustin
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I agree with Jean: play many games on KGS. I’ve found many players willing to play teaching games.
Of course, the best way would be to find an actual OTB go club...
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2011-10-07
Felipe Herman van Riemsdijk
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on 28 Mar: takodori won 4th Shogi Championship
